Check out the newest 360 Health Biz Podcast episode on Email Marketing (part 1!)
First things first, when it comes to your email list – it’s quality over quantity. We seem to be living in this influencer social media mentality that the more followers you have the more money you’ll make selling your services. This is simply not true. You want to have quality leads on your list that are interested in what you’re putting out there.
In addition to WHY you need an email list, in this episode we also discuss:
- social media vs email
- our favourite email providers (hint: it’s not Mailchimp)
- email nurture sequences
- what should/shouldn’t be in your email
- how to create open-worthy subject lines
Tune in now for Part 1 of Email Marketing and be sure to mark you calendar for Part 2 coming up in two weeks.
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Christine: Hello everyone and welcome to this episode of 360 Health Biz Podcast. We are so excited to have you and you are on track again for an amazing episode today where we will talk about a subject. Oh my God, there will be a lot of ranting I predict because it's just been a pet peeve of Kendra's and mine, and we also have very different techniques, really I don't have any so stay tuned for that.
Christine: But before we dive into that, we are happy over the moon because we have reviews. So my beautiful, beautiful Kendra please take it away.
Kendra: All right, thank you for that great intro Christine. Yeah, I think we will be ranting a lot to day because yeah, I've been hearing a lot of crazy things lately from health coaches in regards to email lists and what they're doing to email market. And it's definitely very important thing to do, but also a huge struggle for most.
Kendra: But anyways, to read the review. So the title of the review is "Excellent Content", and it's five stars and it's by Health Coach in Training from Canada. So I love that, fellow Canadian. "Thank you for sharing your knowledge. Your content is relevant, easy to understand, and you're also so fun to listen to. Keep the episodes coming." Yeah!
Christine: I'm like you're fun to listen to.
Kendra: Thank you so much Health Coach in Training, and guys, if you do like our podcasts, because podcast analytics virtually don't exist so the only way for us to know if you like us or if you're listening is to actually leave us a review and let us know what you've found helpful so that we know we're on the right track.
Christine: Yeah, we would appreciate it. Yeah, and also if you have a wish list of things, like something that's not working in your business or that you've been given advice on where you're like, "Really?", just let us know. We'd love to take it apart.
Kendra: Yeah, you can just send us a DM on Instagram or 360 Health Biz podcast, you can just email us. It's just hello@360HealthBizPodcast. Either works, and just let us know because we are here to serve you and we want to know what is actually your struggle because we want to help you basically.
Christine: Exactly, yes. All right, and with that we are off to our topic today, which is email. Oh my God, the topic, I mean email, there's so many blog posts out there, "Is email dead," or, "The secret is in your email list." And I think one thing we can agree on is that the market has changed so, so much in the last four years I would say, especially again in the past two years. And some advice is seriously outdated. I believe there's still some truth in it, but there's been a lot of outdated advice as well. So we're going to look at all the different angles of things that we've experimented with and things that have worked well for us and that haven't.
Christine: But the first point, and this is basically we are doing a series on this because it's such a big topic that we don't want to overwhelm your little brains. So we're going to, this is the first part of the series. And the first point we are going to talk about is why you actually still need an email list. And my mind was blown because I had a conversation yesterday with Kendra and she actually told me about some people that are now working with us who have been given advice of just like don't even have an email list. And it's mind blowing to me. So Kendra maybe just tell a little bit about that example and then we'll take it apart and see why you really, really do need one.
Kendra: Yeah, so I think, I kind of feel like we're aware early on in our business that we need an email list, but we have no idea how to cultivate that. And I think we kind of get, maybe our egos get a little bit caught up because egos are a thing, and we start just wanting the followers on social media. So we try to build our Instagram following or our Facebook following and we get really obsessed with being on social media and having this following. And a lot of us have, I think when it comes to social media, like almost like an influencer mentality that we want to just grow this massive following, but we're not influencers, we're business owners. You don't actually need that many people on a following to be successful, but you do need to get those people off social media and onto an email list because it is a reliable way to communicate with them.
Kendra: You know, yes, people are overwhelmed with the emails in their inbox these days. Yes, not as many people function through email. Like me personally, I almost, I'm not really subscribed to anyone's email list. I just follow them on social media.
Christine: I do have a few, but the ones that I am subscribed to, I'm a loyal follower, and I think that's also a big difference. Four years ago email was still, it wasn't new but it was still exciting. So people had these huge email lists of 10,000 and 50,000 and 100,000 people on there. If you started just a couple of years later, you would not have been able to replicate that simply because the market has changed so much. So if you have for example a coach who's telling you that you need to have an email list of that many people or if you were going to a little bit more about it later, if you can only collaborate with people who have at least 50,000, it's outdated advice in my opinion.
Christine: We're going to look at it a little bit more in detail, but whatever the situation is, social media is great but it doesn't belong to you. And the email list is yours, it's yours to hone, it's yours to print, to prune. The people who are on there want to be on there, they are not unsubscribing once they do. Not your problem, but the people who are still on there, are on there for a reason, which is just the perfect topic for you.
Kendra: I agree, and like it's true. Social media algorithms are always changing and I know in the early days when Facebook first started making their algorithm changes, people lost multi-million businesses overnight because suddenly they couldn't connect or reach the people. So you don't want to base your business off of social media alone, it's a tool. But you do want to funnel people onto an email list.
Kendra: And from there you can communicate with them, you can nurture them. And me personally, I'm someone who launches courses and group programs. All of my launches have been directly correlated to the size of my list. My first launch, I think I generated about $2,000 and I had about like 300 to 400 people on a list. Next launch was about 7,000 to 8,000. I was probably about like 1,000 to 1,500 people. Next launch, at some point, like my most recent launch was about 60,000 and I had about 2,500 on my list. But it's interesting because you think to make 60,000 you'd need a much bigger list, but you don't. It's about people being engaged and it being the right people on the list because I think what's really important is just because you have a lot of people following you doesn't mean you're making money.
Kendra: A lot of those, for example, and I think you've had this experience Christine. Like you ran an online summit probably to build your list. If you ran this big summit, you probably got tens of thousands of people on the list, but after the summit because they actually weren't that interested in you or sleep or whatever it was, they all pieced. So just because you can get that many people on a list, doesn't mean that you can sell to them, right?
Christine: Absolutely. So I think it's a fine balance because people who are going to sign up to your list do so because you're basically bribing them. So as Kendra said before today, everyone is annoyed by emails. It's a stressful, inbox is a stress point nowadays so you don't want to have any spam in there. So it's just a different feeling that people have towards it.
Christine: So in order for them to sign up to an email list, you need to give them something. And we're going to go into detail into what that should be and what that should look like. And I think we actually have an episode on that.
Kendra: Yeah, we did an episode on lead magnets called Five Reasons Why Your Lead Magnets Sucks, or if you're converting or something like that. So listen to that episode, it's actually a great episode. It's funny because when I was going through, we recorded that episode and then I was creating a new lead magnet and I actually re listened to our episode because like, "What did I say? I need to remember my own advice." And I was like it's just funny that I'm listening to myself. [inaudible 00:08:15]
Christine: But yes, so go back and listen to that. We're going to connect that here on the show notes as well. But basically, so you bribe them with something free. So don't get this wrong. The people who, you have two kinds of people who will sign up. You have the person who's literally generally interested in you, who enjoys the way you are and who is already kind of playing with the idea to hire you for your services. And then you have the tire kicker. You have those who are already skeptic, but it's for free. And then you have a third category, which is basically people just wanting free stuff.
Christine: And I find that the percentage of those who are going to stay on your email list for quite a while is actually only growing in quite a small number. And the reason how I really figured it out is every three months I clean up, I purge my complete email list. So anyone who's not been active for three months or hasn't clicked on anything, even if they haven't unsubscribed, they're still on there but they don't engage, they don't read it, I purge them. I clean them out so they're not on my list anymore. And I have to say the number, it's not a lot of people, the amount that it grows. But those people are the real people that I really want to work with.
Christine: So you need to understand that when you do a summit for example, so just for those who don't know what a summit is. A summit is when basically you do an interview series with experts, talking about something related to your field. So I had the Women's Divine Sleep Summit and I had a whole bunch of experts all talking about their expertise in correlation with sleep. So we had sleep and candida, we had chronic fatigue, we had all kinds of different stuff. And it's free for a certain time, people need to sign up, give you your email. So there they get for free, they get access. And then in the end you are selling it because in truth is you have a lot, a lot of video, a lot of footage for a small time. So it's very, very practically impossible to consume it all during the time when it's free. So the goal is to make money on the back end by selling it and maybe up selling to other things as well.
Christine: So my experience is, and I'm doing this too, is I sign up for free, or they sign up for free. They try to consume as much as they can, and then afterwards you will sell them on basically paying to get the recordings forever. And a lot of them, some of them will still do, but I've found I grew my email list massively. So there was a lot of interest, but six months later my email list was pretty much back to what it was before the summit because those people were not really that serious about it. It was free, I made like $800. I didn't do, the summit sold for like $47. It wasn't expensive, so it was like, it was not bad, but it was not a lot of money.
Christine: So, but it was really eye opening to me because it was all these tire kickers basically just consuming for free, but they would never spend a serious amount. And I sold, of course, that was also like forty something bucks and it didn't sell. And I did a survey and they got something for free when they replied to the survey, why that was, was it time, was it price, was it insecurity, whatever. And pretty much unanimously it was, it was too expensive. So I already knew that ...
Kendra: You said it was $47?
Christine: It was $47.
Kendra: Well, holy fuck.
Christine: I know, that was eye opening to me. Now I do think it really depends on the subject that is [inaudible 00:11:49] to. So for me it was really clear, okay I'm not going to spend more energy on the people who are on my list right now, I'm going to keep it alive and I'm going to pitch from time to time, but I still have it because some people do only read my newsletter. It's really weird, but I think you have to engage with your email list from time to time to see whose actually on there. Does it have potential? Should you focus more in growing it? Should you pitch to it? I know that I don't get any sales from my email list. My clients, 90% of them are not on my email list, it's hilarious.
Christine: So that's my specific bit, my specific kind of knowledge of my list and how I focus. But for Kendra for example, it's the other way around. Her buyers are on her list and it converts very, very well. Whatever it is though, the people are interested in you. You have to grab them. You have to at least have the possibility to figure out whether they are money in your pocket, and if you don't, you will leave money on the table. So it is your responsibility to have them sign up and to at least try and to at least see if you can convince them.
Christine: And writing a weekly newsletter is not hard. Listen again to our first episode with Jamie Palmer and she has a whole system and then both Kendra and I implemented that way most of the time I think. So listen to that and you have content. But I think the most important thing is that the people on there are always faithful. So they will recommend you, they will have you in their heads. I know that they religiously read what I write. They might not come back as clients, but I know that if anyone is ever going to talk to them about a sleep issue, that they will recommend me because they are just fascinated by what I do.
Christine: So it's something that is in my opinion a non-negotiable to have. But the size of it does not matter, it really doesn't.
Kendra: I totally agree and I wonder if the difference between me and you is just between what we're selling, because you're selling this higher ticket like one on one and people are finding you and they're trusting you based on where you've been featured. You've been featured in all these big publications, you've been on TV, all that stuff. So like for people who have more money to spend, they're like, "I want the best and I see this chick everywhere." So you don't really need to be on your email list, right?
Christine: Exactly, plus you know pretty unanimously they find me at three am, they're exhausted. Those people are never going to read emails. They are just like, you know it's also my opt in, it's a training. Most people don't have the nerves to do that, I know that, I really am aware of it but it's a fantastic fucking good training. But I'm very, very much aware that it's not the perfect opt in, but it's just most people find me through Google and they book a call and I convert them that way. So it is a specific situation.
Kendra: Yeah, and it is a bit different because I'm selling courses and gap programs so I need higher volume. Like I need to, if I want to hit my goals with my [inaudible 00:14:47] course, I'm like I need to sell to 50 people. Next round I want to sell to 100. So it's just like, yeah I do need the list. And so I think regardless, you need an email list, you want to culture that. You want to nurture it because like Christine for example, you might shift your focus at some point. You might decide to go a different direction in your business and you want to have those people.
Kendra: But if you are someone, and I know a lot of coaches out there, you do want to have group programs or you do want to go have a course at some point, so you need to focus on this now. And for me personally, if I do look at a regret that I had with starting my business, I wish I started building my email list sooner because I didn't really take it seriously until about, I don't know, two years in or something like that. And as soon as I started working on it, I had six figures within a year. So it was very, an important part of my success.
Christine: I agree, and I think an email list is what drives the numbers in terms of when you sell mid ticket, mid ticket to low ticket. If you have something that's around like $1,000, the email list is the way to go. For me, a minimum is $7,000, I'm never going to sell that by an email. It's just, well I'm never going to say never, you never know, but it's just a different way of doing business. If I had that product, which might come at some point, I know that I will create more awareness, different opt ins, different funnels to get people towards that. At the moment, it's not my priority, but even if it's not my priority, I do take it seriously.
Christine: I have it in place and have the shortest funnel in the world. Funnel basically means that when people sign up what they say, I have one email that's it. So, but I do know that it's just because it's not my priority, but at the same time I love the people on my email list and I get really interesting feedback from them sometimes. So it's an important piece of the puzzle I believe.
Christine: And then another thing, oh God, was that you talked to someone about our master mind and basically they were ... What were they doing? They were selling things and they didn't have an email list. Exactly, yes, so they had ...
Kendra: Yeah, so this particular lovely lady who has so much potential in her business, very much excited to help her access that potential but yeah, she was selling this group program and selling quite a few spots, which is pretty impressive, but all off of social media. There was no email funnel, there was no, and no one was on the email list. So it's just not, that's not predictable or reliable because you literally, you can make this plan for this launch and maybe it went well last time, but if the algorithm has changed or you know I don't know, like things can be glitchy with Instagram. Like my swipe up feature stopped working for like two weeks randomly and it was just some like weird glitch. Or I've been blocked on Instagram before randomly, so it's just like it's not reliable. If you have those people and they did your group program, you want them on your list because potentially those people are going to buy from you again, right?
Christine: That's it, I was going to say. They are return customers, especially like the first thing. That's what I do. If I buy a course with someone, I will see what's coming up, what's next. And sometimes it takes me a couple of years, but then I will join their master mind or their conference or whatever it is, or their membership. So these people are very likely return customers and so you letting them go is just literally taking money and just like poof, throwing it in the air and it's gone. So really make sure that you keep those people somewhere safe, like where they belong to you, for sure.
Kendra: Absolutely. So let's talk a little bit about email list providers because a few of the people I was talking to as well, I was like, "Who's your email provider?" And they're like, "Gmail." I'm like, okay, that's not going to work. First of all you're limited. I think Gmail only allows you to send mass emails to 500 people. But if you're sending a mass email from Gmail, like whoa. Other email providers see all the email addresses and they think it's spam.
Christine: It's spam. There's no chance that you will even land in the spam folder at times, you will just be destroyed.
Kendra: Yeah, and I mean you don't want that because it's like we all get these email scores over time. And if your email score is bad, it just means that you're going to have really low open rates and you aren't going to open. So you can't keep people in Gmail. I don't even know if it's technically legal.
Christine: I don't think so to be honest. I really don't think that's something that mass emails is just that legal. I also want to say I don't think it's professional to be honest. Like I like, Gmail for me is private. Even businesses who have a Gmail address, I'm like, "You're skimping. Why don't you have a domain? Why don't you have an email address with your domain? You're a professional, take your business seriously." So it leaves a bitter aftertaste in my mouth to be honest.
Christine: So you should take it to what we call a CRM and that's basically a platform where you can manage your clients and email them in bulk in a way, but also you can design it in a very nice way. And we're going to talk about that a little bit too. And there are very simple ones, and there are very complicated ones. And my very first one was the most complicated one in the market that is designed for multi-million corporations and I had like five people.
Kendra: Was that Infusionsoft?
Christine: That was Infusionsoft. I was totally sold on it on my first conference that I went to. And I didn't know what pitching was, and I just, "Yes!" Oh God, I was so naïve, so don't do that, really don't do that. There's a lot of other options out there and we're going to walk through them. Fascinatingly enough both Kendra and I had the same experience that people set us up with the same one, it's Mailchimp.
Kendra: It's Mailchimp.
Christine: I don't know why.
Kendra: I think maybe it's the most common one or maybe it has good SCEO and it comes up. You know what I actually think it is Christine? I think it's because there's a free option and so people get stuck on because they can, and I started with that too because it was free and you're like, "Well I don't want to spend." But Mailchimp will drive you fucking crazy because ...
Christine: I think it is also one of the first ones so a lot of business coaches just recommend what they started with.
Kendra: Totally, totally. I mean I think MailChimp is good if you're like a brick and mortar business and you don't have funnels, you don't have different lists. You're literally just sending out a newsletter, like old school style. That's fine but the problem with Mailchimp is you'll quickly move past the free option, I think after 500 people you're over it. And it's so frustrating because things that should be easy are really complicated. They charge you based off of numbers and if you have three lists, so let's say you do essential oils and then you also do health coaching. So you have people who have opted in for essential oils and then people who have opted in for like health coaching stuff. But if you have one of those people and they're on the same lists, they are counted as two people in Mailchimp which is bullshit.
Christine: It's total bullshit, yeah.
Kendra: It's a huge pain in the ass.
Christine: In another system you would call it a segment and that's fine. You just pay for the one email address, it's always in bulk [inaudible 00:22:10]. So you get penalized in a way of how many people you have, and also the features that are unlocked. Like things, suddenly everything you have to pay for, like for certain, it's design features but it's also practicality features like timing, scheduling things out, trying A and B models. Sometimes you just want to just test which email style works better, and so you have features where you can send out the same email but in two different designs and test A and B and you will see where they click and that might be how you design the next email and so forth. So all of those are paid, like you have to pay for them and it gets really expensive after a certain time.
Kendra: It does, and in the end you're paying more for a shitty email provider versus something that is a lot more functional. I always tell my clients to go with ActiveCampaign. I've used ActiveCampaign personally. I actually moved from ActiveCampaign and now I regret it so I'm going to be going back to them. But they have like, their start up is like $15 a month. It's not expensive, I think you get $15 a month for up to 1,000 people. It's pretty user friendly, they have good customer service and it can handle all the complex funnels. So as you grow and you want to implement more complex funnels and whatever, it can handle it so then you don't have to switch, which is awesome.
Christine: They're great. Yeah, I'm using MailerLite. My list is tiny so it's free, but I like it. It has everything you need. It has landing pages, you can design whatever you want. You can put GIFs in there, you can segment, you can schedule, you can track it with Google. I really like it, I enjoy it. It looks good, it's easy to use and it's very affordable.
Christine: Another one that I know that a lot of people use is Drip, I think quite a few. And there was another one, Constant Contact. Is that possible?
Kendra: Constant Contact, yeah. And there's like GetResponse. A lot of people, a lot of the bigger marketers, and this is what I use is ConvertKit. Now ConvertKit is a higher price point and I pay about $50 a month for it, but it has all the capabilities of ActiveCampaign but there are some things about it that drive me insane. For example, like the emails, they're all just in a big overwhelming list. Like you can't, what I would love if there was a tab for like scheduled, drafts and sent. There's not, they're all just listed. So you have to scroll through and for my business, we have, I have my course, we have our membership.
Kendra: So we send out like so many emails, and then also we send out two emails to my list a week so it's like crazy. So you're like looking for an email and you're scrolling through and it's really overwhelming. And then when you want to update one and it's already been scheduled, you have to return it into a draft and then it just disappears into the list and you have to find it again. It drives me insane.
Kendra: And you can't do analytics on your emails. So it doesn't tell you which are your best performing emails and like anyways ...
Kendra: Yeah, it's super weird. So I've sent them a bunch of like notes to customer service. I'm like, "Can you please do this?"
Christine: It's not hard, yeah.
Kendra: It's not hard, and I'm like this is super overwhelming. We send out so many emails and we cannot find them. And they were just like, "Yeah, we're not going to do that." So I'm like, "Okay, I'm going to move back to ActiveCampaign." And the whole thing about ActiveCampaign is they will do your transfer for you for free. So they will just do it all for you, so that's my plan. I have a bunch of stuff in there from when I was health coaching so I need to delete like 50 funnels in there and just edit it down because I don't want everything transferred over. But I'm like yep, ActiveCampaign rocks. See you ConvertKit. But anyways ...
Christine: No, I totally agree, I totally agree. And then all of them work pretty much the same way, it's like a drag and drop kind of thing. But doing like a side note on what you should include in your email, obviously it depends what you're selling. If you have products, yes, you need to have images, maybe a GIF and so forth. However, what we found that converts fast in terms of not being put into spam straightaway is to have nothing in your email, like literally just text. You also need the unsubscribe button, but I try not to have a single link in my email. I literally tell people if you want to get in touch, just reply to this email. I don't link it, the only link I have is the unsubscribe button, that's it. And I don't even use colors, it's black text. Sometimes it's a little bit of pink in there, but in general it's just black text. There's no fancy whatever-ish in them and no images and it's just, it looks I guess for algorithms, it just looks more serious and business-y versus difficult ads.
Kendra: Yeah, like even more just like a regular email. And you know, so what I was going to say what I found is if you have an email sequence, like a nurture sequence that's going out to people who haven't opened your emails before, you want to keep it as empty as possible so that it doesn't end up in their spam.
Kendra: But for example, with my membership, for people who open my emails and I know they're not going into people's spam because they've been opening my emails. Like we send out a newspaper with all kinds of images and links, but we know that people are opening them. So once you have people who are consistently opening your emails, you can start adding images.
Christine: You're safe.
Kendra: You're safe to do that, but right off the bat if it's like the first email that they're getting as a confirmation for your lead magnet, don't have an image, don't have a header. Just keep it super simple, be like, "Hey, super excited that you opted in. This is fantastic. I'm Kendra, you're awesome, I'm awesome. Here's the download link. And hey, I'm going to send you another email tomorrow. It's titled this and this is what I'm going to tell you in it," and that's it.
Christine: That is it. I love GIFs, I'm still loving GIFs. So I just had every email had like a hilarious GIF, which made me laugh. Like I don't know, I just think I'm hilarious with GIFs, but I can't do it anymore.
Kendra: I do too.
Christine: Yeah, but I can't do it anymore. It doesn't like, especially because my funnel is so short, it's just one email after that they get the regular newsletter. It's just I can't do it. But I do have to say it also saves you tons of time. It's just really easy, so but it's maybe something that's very different obviously because also the email providers will want you to use all of their features and bells and whistles which is super cute, but just from conversion perspective, from our pro advice it's not worth it. Keep it very simple.
Kendra: Totally, yeah, and so something you can do and this will work is so on the first email that I send someone, is I always ask them to reply to the email with something quick. So for example when I was doing fatigue, I would say, "Hey, I would love to know out of 10, where would you rate your fatigue? Just reply to this email and let me know." And for the people who do reply, if they reply, like your emails are probably never going to end up in their promotions or spam folder again, plus it's really good market research because you can see where people are at.
Kendra: Like I tell people, now that I'm doing business coaching, I'm like, "How would you describe your business? How do you feel about your business right now in one word? Reply to this email." And people will be like, "Overwhelmed," or like, "Frazzled," and so I can actually see the words that they're using and get an idea of what words I should be using in my sales copy, right?
Christine: Exactly, and I also find the first email is basically when they watched the training, have a couple of testimonials in there, and then I'm just basically, "What are your sleep struggles? Just let me know. I'm generally interested." And I don't get too many people replying, but there's always a few who are like, "Hey Christine, well this and this has happened." And then I'm saying, "Oh wow, let's get you this idea, but if you want to talk more about it, let's schedule a call." They schedule a call and they convert into clients ideally. And that's a seven pay client, so that conversion is really, really good. So it works. Again it's different and maybe if I had more people on the list it would be even better, like 2020.
Kendra: Even me, who I probably have like, I can't remember, 25 to 3,000 or something on my email list. I don't get a ton of replies, but I get some and the people who do ...
Christine: That's some.
Kendra: Yeah, and that's what matters right, is those people who do reply, like they're engaged. And you're going to send them ...
Christine: We love them.
Kendra: We love them, and we're going to send them like a super personal response. Don't get your assistant to reply, don't ignore it, actually write them back and be like, "Hey, thanks so much for replying. So sorry that you're feeling so like overwhelmed with your sleep. Stay tuned, or you can maybe check out this or I have a really good video that might help you here." Serve them, right, and those people are going to be like super into your shit.
Christine: Exactly, and especially if you do have a great collection of blog posts, which you should do and we talked about that in episode number one, I think it's ... Is it episode one or two? No, it is episode number one. And you can literally it will take you two seconds to just say, "I have a blog post on this. Just go there," or give the link. It's no work for you at all, but it's going to create these amazing fans that just love you in the end, so yeah.
Kendra: I wanted to say one more thing about email deliverability before we move on, and that's just your subject line. Subject lines will make or break your email open rates. So in terms of open rate, that's just means the percentage of people who are opening your emails. And your email provider, whatever it is, will tell you that. Now industry standard for health and wellness is about 20%. So that's what you're aiming for, somewhere around 20%, which seems low, but whatever, 20% okay. But a lot of people make terrible mistakes with subject lines. Like you know, like your subject line can't be like, "October Newsletter".
Christine: Oh fuck hell no.
Kendra: Or the other mistake I see people make is they actually give away the email in the subject line, you know.
Christine: Like what?
Kendra: They're like, something like "The gut is the main cause of your thyroid dysfunction".
Christine: Oh yeah, yeah, or yes.
Kendra: You want to like intrigue people right, and this is what's worked for me personally and you're going to have to test it. That's why the A B split function for subject lines can be really helpful, but what works really well for me is something that kind of sounds a little bit personal like, "Hey, have you seen this," or, "I did this and I really can't believe I did," or like, "Wow, that really pissed people off," or something like that where it's like intriguing but it's also somewhat personal. But again guys, don't do click baits. Don't just put something to get people to click, make sure it's still relevant to the email because if you use click bait you're going to just piss people off.
Christine: And I think, one thing, I'm just going to give you a little insider tip here. Something you can do is going to Laura Belgray's home page, it's called the Talking Shrimp. Sign up for her newsletter. You don't need to read them, but her headlines are fucking awesome. It's just, it's like, "I fought it and then this happened," or, "You know when you're super lazy like me, do this." I don't even know, but I have a folder which is just her newsletters and it's just when I need a really cool subject line, I will be inspired by that because it's just, it's open. She's magic, she's one of the most talented copy writers out there and you can just learn so much from how to do this just by seeing and looking at what she does.
Christine: So you don't need to copy/paste it. You shouldn't obviously, it should be your style. She has a very certain way of talking and that works because it's her. Obviously if it's not you, don't do it, but it is going to give you permission to really be yourself because you can see how she's totally herself and you certainly have permission too to be yourself. So go to the Talking Shrimp, Laura Belgray, sign up for her newsletter. Study it, have a look, she has an amazing course as well, sign up for that. I think it's pretty great value and everything she teaches is just fucking awesome.
Kendra: That's very cool.
Christine: So really, really go there and see what is doable for subject lines. It will change so much.
Kendra: Yeah, and another thing you can do is go in, if you have a Gmail account, go into your promotions folder because that's typically where all the promos end up and look at the subject lines and look at what intrigues you to want to open up something. Like when you see, "50% off," you're like, "Fuck no, because I don't want to buy anything right now."
Christine: Unless it's like some really nice lingerie. I'm like, "Sure," like [inaudible 00:34:29]. You know, but those are also, look at the business. Some commercial e-commerce store is going to have a very different way of marketing than a service provider. It's just different. So business coaches will be different than health coaches. So look at things where you click, where you're like, "Oh, I need this now. I didn't know I did, but now I do." That's who you want to be.
Christine: So we talked about quite a few things. We have more things coming up and that's on how to get people on your list, not that easy, but we will tell you how. We will also tell you the text stuff in terms of legal stuff, people, how to up the GDPR a little bit, and also how you can get people to actually see that you exist and then to sign up. And if you have any further questions, just please send them over to us and we'll talk about them too.
Kendra: Yeah, totally. Yeah, if you guys have questions, just connect with us on Instagram or shoot us an email Hello@360HealthBizPodcast or just 360 Health Biz Podcast for our Instagram account, or you can just email either one of us personally ChristineISleepLikeABoss, I'm KendraPerryInc because we are on Instagram all day long and we just respond to all our DMs, yeah.
Christine: We're totally addicted.
Kendra: We are addicted. We love Instagram.
Christine: Word. All right my dear people, we're going to launch episode, the next episode on this topic in two weeks after you listen to this. So either you can binge on it if it's already released, and if not you will hear it in two weeks. And that's it.
Kendra: So that's all we got.
Christine: That's all we've got for now.
Kendra: Peace out Holmes.